[ilds] Religions in Egypt

[Lee Sternthal]

sorry to be lazy, but does Haag cover where Dionysus would have picked up
Pre-Nicaea Chrisitianity, let alone adopted it as belief system enough to
convert populace? Before Constantine Christianity was just another competing
ethos, wasn't it?

L

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 9:59 AM, Bruce Redwine
<bredwine1968 at earthlink.net>wrote:

> Interesting questions.  Michael Haag's *The Timeline History of Egypt*(New York 2005) is useful in providing facts.  "247-64 Dionysus is the first
> patriarch of Alexandria actively to convert the native Egyptians" (p. 156).
>  The pharaonic religion persisted until supplanted by Christianity, but even
> now aspects of the "old religion" still exist.  If I'm not mistaken, the
> ancient "Opet festival" in pharaonic Thebes has a modern reflex in today's
> Luxor, under a new guise.  Durrell is very good at picking up the syncretic
> features of folk religion in Egypt.  In *Clea,* Scobie dies and becomes a
> Coptic saint, *El Yacoub*, and an Arabic one, *El Scob* (p. 82).  Also,
> Durrell's evocations of superstitions such as "the Evil Eye" are quite
> memorable.
>
>
> Bruce
>
>
>
> On Aug 14, 2010, at 2:31 AM, Lee Sternthal wrote:
>
> At what point were the Copts converted to Christianity, and by whom?  What
> was their belief system before?  It couldn't have been before the 3rd
> Century.
>
> On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 3:55 PM, Bruce Redwine <bredwine1968 at earthlink.net
> > wrote:
>
>> No offense intended, but Lawrence Durrell makes a distinction between the
>> Copts and the general Egyptian population.  He fully develops his Coptic
>> theme in *Mountolive* (Penguin 1991).  Here is what Durrell has Mr.
>> Hosnani, Sr., say about his Coptic roots:  "'Do you know what they call us —
>> the Moslems? . . . I will tell you.  *Gins Pharoony.*  Yes, we are *genus
>> Pharaonicus* — the true descendants of the ancients, the true marrow of
>> Egypt.  We call ourselves *Gypt* — ancient Egyptians.  Yet we are
>> Christians like you, only of the oldest and purest strain'" (p. 41).
>>
>> As I said before, I believe most Egyptians are in fact descendants of the
>> ancient Egyptians.  That population, however, speaks Arabic, as a
>> consequence of Amr's invasion in 641 CE.  A version of the original Egyptian
>> language is preserved in the liturgy of the Coptic Church, and the Copts,
>> who are Christians, think of themselves as a distinct minority within Egypt
>> — and as Tarek Heggy, an Egyptian Muslim, has pointed out, Copts are treated
>> differently.  This distinctiveness is what Durrell picks up on and
>> elaborates in the *Quartet.*  So, I would not call Durrell's usage of
>> "Copt" and all its connotations a "new trend."
>>
>>
>> Bruce
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Aug 13, 2010, at 2:12 PM, nabila marzouk wrote:
>>
>> Dear group,
>> It hurts very much, I mean the new trend of saying that copts are the true
>> descendents of ancient Egyptians. I donot know based on what  this rumour is
>> so widely spread. As an Egyptian muslim I am the descendent of king Thut and
>> queen Hatshpsut. When we celebrate anything national here we dress like
>> ancient egyptians and talk about their glorious history. We never speak of
>> ourselves as arabs or think that we have any arabic ancestors. Read history
>> and you will know that most of the Egyptian muslims were descendents of a
>> certain creed of Egyptian Christians who differed immensely from Orthodox
>> church and also of christians who embraced Islam. Read history and you will
>> know that when Amr left Egypt only no more than ten thousand arabic people
>> stayed behind. Read history and you will know that it took Egypt more than
>> 300 years to have the Islamic majority she has now which negates the idea
>> that muslims are descendents of arabs while christians are descendents of
>> ancient egyptians, otherwise I can say that christians are descendents of
>> the Romans. The word copt should be used to refer to both muslims and
>> christians because it means egyptian in ancient egyptian language. Please do
>> not speak about me as if I were less Egyptian than I really am.
>> nabila
>>
>> --- On *Wed, 7/28/10, Bruce Redwine <bredwine1968 at earthlink.net>* wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>
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